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:: NQR kickoff. almost ready :: Big news update :: 030303
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Clients.
About clients, we will also like to remind you, that the ONLY 2 sollutions allowed, is FuhQuake with a valid security module and Mqwcl 0.96 (both clients can ofcourse use local/public Qizmos, but these will not be allowed to use for client verification).
FuhQuake need to have '-ruleset smackdown' on cmdline. Here is some info about how to use it:
SMACKDOWN RULESET
-----------------
The smackdown ruleset differs from the default ruleset in the following ways.
*) The variables tp_triggers, tp_msgtriggers, cl_trueLightning, cl_clock, r_aliasstats are disabled.
*) If a server has no maxfps serverinfo key, then up to 77 fps is allowed instead of the default 72 fps limit.
*) When pressing tab to bring up the scoreboard, the seconds drawn in the clock are only accurate to 10 seconds (seconds may be removed completely in the future).
Example on fuhquake cmdline: 'fuhquake.exe -dinput -ruleset smackdown +cl_confirmquit 0'
We are currently working on a more secure, simpler system for NQR5. That will make the whole security issue, something to think and deal less with, so that you can concentrate more on team tactics, and showing up for games *HINT HINT*.
Just to make it clear for everyone, why we choose NOT to allow Qizmo+qwcl combination.
Qizmo verifies the QWCL client, and checks if it is a genuine client. If you use an aimbot client or modified in any way, the qizmo wont start with the client, and you will get a QIZMO AND QWCL STARTED SEPERATLY on f_version.
The problem with this is that you need a minimum of 2 players using qwcl+qizmo on the server, to compare and verify that they have genuine versions of qizmo+qwcl. Seeing as MQWCL and FuhQuake are soo popular, almost noone still uses Qizmo. Having only one player with qizmo+qwcl on a server, would mean that you wouldn't be able to check for cheats, in a proper way.
The most optimal sollution is to have all using just one client. Simply because its more secure, its easier to check for cheats and correct versions, and easier to update for people. Cause there is only one standard. Having 2 clients in play at one time is troubled enough, as you have to deal with 2 kind of verrifications. But having 3 is too much. It will become chaotic, when having to check for cheats.
FuhQuake was introduced to NQR this season because of its enourmus acceptance and developing. But working towards a safer and simpler QuakeWorld scene in scandinavia for both players and clans, aswel as events and online tournaments/leauges, I would personally advice people outthere to prepare for a singularity in the QW client issue.
In an enviroment where the (background)scene is run by voulenteers and gamers in generel, we have to rely partly on good client/server development, and a
great deal of fairplay mentality from both players, clans and ourselfs.
I hope this gave some sort of understanding why we choose not to allow Qizmo+QWCL. If you still have questions or suggestions about this issue, please post a comment.
Maps.
On request by some clans, we decided to re-add 2 maps from NQR season 3 map pool. It regards 'The Gloom Keep' (E1M5) and 'The Haunted Halls' (E3M7).
So to make sure all clans are aware of possible maps, your opponents might choose, take a good look at the final map list for NQR season 4.
DM2 - Claustrophobopolis
DM3 - The Abandoned Base
E1M2 - Castle of the Damned
E1M5 - The Gloom Keep
E1M6 - The Door to Chthon
E2M2 - The Ogre Citadel
E2M7 - The Underearth
E3M1 - Termination Central
E3M2 - The Vaults of Zin
E3M3 - The Tomb of Terror
E3M6 - Chambers of Torment
E3M7 - The Haunted Halls
Servers.
I am currently awaiting the finalization of the new QW server @ bredbandsbolaget. This will be a dedicated 4on4 server, which means that bredbandsbolaget will have increased QW server capacity, and hopefully enough at this point to cover the need for this season. More news on that as soon as its running.
We are aware that the serverlist is not updated, but we got another thing in store for you. A new QW server lister/browser, has been developed by Zalon, and if you want a sneak preview, you can take a look here. You can click on a server to check further status, or copy ip with the icon to the far left. There will be a link to 'dump' the current serverlist to a list you can use for Mqwcl.
While we are getting that on NQR page, I strongly advice using http://www.udpsoft.com/eye to find your favourite clan server.
At the moment we are just waiting for our webcoder to initiate the fixtures, so you can all begin your games.
During next few weeks we will try and eliminate bugs on the page, and needed updates.
All there is left to say is good luck to all you brave quakers outthere :)
May the best clans win!
// ParadokS
93 comments.
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| Eta-Beta - 217.209.190.142 |
030303 @ 16:45:05 |
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bah gg
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| Eta-Beta - 217.209.190.142 |
030303 @ 16:45:26 |
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I made that one for hagge because he isn't at home :)
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| fifi - 80.222.185.138 |
030303 @ 16:49:11 |
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"When pressing tab to bring up the scoreboard, the seconds drawn in the clock are only accurate to 10 seconds (seconds may be removed completely in the future). "
i know this works in fuhquake, is it the same with mqwcl?
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| fifi - 80.222.185.138 |
030303 @ 16:51:19 |
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and removing the seconds is imo a bad idea :) you cant beat the feeling you get when you steal quad with perfect timing and kill enemy rl/lg with quad-sg/ssg/etc....!
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| zanne - 217.210.38.179 |
030303 @ 16:58:15 |
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GG para,
This seems fair enough, but i dont know if their are any cheaters anymore, i mean u dont do it ;) kiddin...
This is my second real nqr season, and im looking forward with a smile for it...
GL!
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| Strife - 217.209.135.79 |
030303 @ 17:00:41 |
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Great, EarthQuake is going to kick butt!
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| Apollyon - 212.202.175.201 |
030303 @ 17:09:55 |
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e1m6 is a sucky sucky map for campers, can't understand why it is in the list while there are better maps.
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| flinty - 217.211.51.22 |
030303 @ 17:14:09 |
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apollyon, e3m2 is kind off the same :/
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| Eta-Beta - 217.209.190.142 |
030303 @ 17:30:36 |
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And e1m5 is just norweigan...
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| Norwegian asshole - 217.70.229.196 |
030303 @ 17:32:05 |
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And e3m2 is just swedish...
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| Hagge - 217.209.191.69 |
030303 @ 17:34:01 |
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gl @ll clans :>
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| fix - 130.234.185.108 |
030303 @ 18:00:28 |
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i totaly agree with fifi, it should be atleast same with both clients...but still there are those eggwatch lamers!
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030303 @ 18:01:10 |
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still dont think the players of nqr WILL cheat
this is such a mature community
SO LET US PLAY QWCL+QIZMO IF WE WANT TO! I?ll send demos or whatever I DO NOT CHEAT. fuh and mqwcl doesnt work PROPERLY on my machine EVEN after having tested several cfgs and settings including paradoks fuhquake cfg...
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| ok98 - 217.210.86.200 |
030303 @ 18:25:39 |
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can u cheet with qwcl + qizmo?
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030303 @ 18:28:54 |
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They say u can cheat if u are the only one on the server playing qwcl+qizmo but thats not the point. I think it is discriminating :(
I cant play as i would like to
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| Fulltime job ? - 80.161.20.66 |
030303 @ 18:31:19 |
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Sorry, but admining NQR is not, and should not be a fulltime job for voulenteers. So no thanks, plz dont use qizmo+qwcl, and send us demos of that. Besides we cant use demos for anything in that relation, since the client verrification has to be done on the server, and has to be minimum 2 players with qizmo. Just do as rules say, and use fuhquake or mqwcl.
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030303 @ 18:33:14 |
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And for Apollyon. E1M6 is not for campers. It is of perfetc size for tdm. And u have to be real skilled and have a close teamplay in order to win on it, like every other "approved" tdm map. In my opinion the cmt maps are too big for tdm, they are more weel suited for atleast 16 player FFA. So if you think E1M6 is a camper map then you probably haven?t played it in or vs a good clan, cuz they sure as hell dont have 3-4 guys guarding RL, which i think you are meaning whith camping. Learn to play e1m6 and stop whine about the maplist.
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| Apollyon - 212.202.175.201 |
030303 @ 18:58:57 |
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I have played e1m6 often enough and actually i think it is a fine ffa map but in teamplay? Come on, just one rocketlauncher and a ya next to it? Too easy to camp, because you cannot rush the position with boomsticks nor attack with quad. Anyway, i wont be playing, just wanted to point out that it is a very boring map.
He who complains about the size of cmt maps should learn how to bunnyhop or try to remember how fucking huge dm3 and dm2 were 6 years ago.
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| Legio! - 217.210.255.154 |
030303 @ 19:24:10 |
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That server list/browser will be neat to use, looks really good.
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| Link - 217.70.229.196 |
030303 @ 20:09:03 |
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e1m6 can be CS, kind of like e3m3, where each team holds an area each. And just like the "RA-team" on e3m3 is the "aggresive" team, the "RL-team" is the "aggresive" team on e1m6. If you DO KNOW how to play e1m6, then you know that the "RL-team" is not very safe if they dont get Quad. KOFF played The Axemen twice on e1m6 in nqr2, and it was very fun and exciting to play, even if KOFF got the RL-area at start both times. Axemen just waited at Quad with sng/ssg/ya/mega, and they killed RL's almost every time KOFF attacked. Axemen got enough RLs to turn the tables around, no doubt, but KOFF was just the better team on that map, and won both games with narrow margins. But hey, if you like to play +forward-dm6-lamer-I-will-rock-u-coz-I-own style, ye sure, then e1m6 will suck pretty bad =)
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| billy - 80.49.74.178 |
030303 @ 21:40:04 |
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yeye whine whine whine just get started with those fixtures plz :X
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030303 @ 22:13:08 |
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Still don?t think there is enough reason to ban qwcl
lame as hell nqr...
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| Legio! - 217.210.255.154 |
030303 @ 22:24:00 |
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Apperently you are amongst the minority who thinks so Horatio ;). Most ppl have allready converted a long time ago to either Mqwcl or FuhQuake. I do belive our reason's for not allowing qwcl-qizmo combo is legit, and it was very well explained to you by Paradoks.
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030303 @ 22:56:32 |
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Well explained or not
This is nazi methods, it is like not letting jews play in nqr. Booooooring admins
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| Babel - 217.209.185.105 |
030303 @ 23:54:14 |
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Gah! Stop whining about cs in 4on4. If you play cs in 1on1 its boring, but in 4on4?
Its Much funnier to watch a game were the teams are in group and attacks in group, as in e1m6. Its not fun to se totally broest (ffa) all the time and as I said.. e1m6 is very exciting to spec when the teams playing cs.
Over and out
thats about
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| Sassa - 213.112.135.213 |
030304 @ 00:02:49 |
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Totaly correct babel, in 4on4 u should play cs, specially when u got RL.. its dmm1 ffs!! and controling each side of one map and trying to take over the other part is trully fun to spectate!
BTW, get the league running, and i still miss the cmt maps, but hey, we got the cmt league ;)
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| Parasite - 217.208.44.130 |
030304 @ 00:29:12 |
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*gn?rk unf*
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| xhrl - 24.69.255.236 |
030304 @ 05:30:21 |
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glad to see fuhquake is gaining so much acceptance among the euporean qw scene. I bet with a few more software code tweaks the fuhquake client will surpass the mqwcl client. But we shall see. Yet it is clear the fuh is very busy at constantly developing and the fuhquake client.
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| Goljat - 195.10.181.164 |
030304 @ 09:45:47 |
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about those demo sending, you cant see in demos if you are using modified models (like bolt). TP messages are better in fuhquake (if scripts) and thats why i recommend to everyone use fuhq.
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| :EEE - 212.178.7.54 |
030304 @ 09:52:02 |
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I think there must be a solution for the problem with QWCL+Qizmo. I totally agree with Horatio, he's not the only one playing it and having trouble with mqwcl and fuh, myself for instance.
What I'm trying to say is: There hasn't got to be an admin present at every game. You state yourself SO OFTEN that there are very little people still using it.
My proposition is the following:
Every clan that has a player using qwcl+qizmo can be asking an admin to come to the server. This admin might use qwcl+qizmo (everybody has it so it shouldn't be a problem) and check if the player cheats by comparing the f_xxxx with his own worths.
This isn't a hell of a job or taking "SO MUCH TIME AND EFFORT! WE CAN'T DO THAT IN EVERY GAME!"
Yeppp, thats what I say. You know there are not many people using it. Maybe it's in one or two clans, that means it should be done four times a week? There are eight admins? It seems not taking this much time and really, it helps so much for the players.
Then, in case there is no admin present, the player HAS to play with mqwcl/fuh. It will be a gesture to the qwcl+qizmo players, if the admins c?n't do it in a game, we have to addept, alright, that's a pitty. But there are many occasions on which an admin c?n help out. So, please can you fix this? It isn't unbelieve trouble...
Quake is a gentlemans sport, 'great deal of fairplay mentality from both players, clans and ourselfs.' (c) Paradoks
It would be such a damn great thing if you could only get this little thing in it :<
And once again. I don't ask to do it EVERY game. Only if an admin is available for it ok? With that I already ask enough for 'us' the qwlc+qizmo players.
I hope we will be helped out, you too Hora :>
Thanks a lot, I have great confidence in you guys.
greats
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| Goljat - 195.10.181.164 |
030304 @ 10:02:07 |
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you just download mqwcl and exec your old qw 2.30 cfg and type two commands adduser player;cfg_save. Then all same settings are in mqwcl than in qwcl. If you still use qizmo no need to change (fps settings, etc...)
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| Goljat - 195.10.181.164 |
030304 @ 10:05:25 |
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forgot to say, change tp_expand_code to 0. Load your config with login player command. Come to #nqr and admins/other can help you about client things, but do this BEFORE the game
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| Question - 159.134.224.49 |
030304 @ 11:12:49 |
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I use idGamma, and when me or some one else does f_modified, it reports pallete.lmp. So, do i have to remove idgamma for league games?
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| kryten - 194.129.217.113 |
030304 @ 11:26:17 |
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Fixtures will be up tonight - sorry for the delay, I was away for the weekend.
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| Elec - 212.54.15.57 |
030304 @ 11:51:05 |
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the seconds removal doesnt really change anything for me, i've used a normal clock below my screen for a long time (mwahah come and get it u c43rb43r mong0rs)
only thing that would prevent that would be random +- 10 sec (or something like that) powerup spawns.. and that affects everyone then ;}
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| :EEE - 212.178.7.54 |
030304 @ 12:55:06 |
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Golle, read what Horatio sais....
"fuh and mqwcl doesnt work PROPERLY on my machine EVEN after having tested several cfgs and settings"
Explains it all
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| Tuna - 213.20.131.3 |
030304 @ 12:56:22 |
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bah.. seconds removal.. and i skilled myself so many hours in that scoreboard clock... so i actually have to set up an real life clock instead again.. so whats the point in removing that? youre giving people advantage who use mqwclm, can afford a decent clock or a 5th man who can time items :/
and then again.. i dont really see the point in removing qwcl + qizmo - it was reliable all the years we played.. and i cant think of a serious cheating issue since. l33t hax0r players already aim better than any bot anyway... and i also always hear that fuh- and mqwcl are cheaty clients with their jump predictions etc.. so what are we afraid of? p.s. no im using fuh.. and p.p.s oh it lets me toggle noaim ingame.. thats surprisingly nice for shotgun scripts.. p.p.p.s no im not using scripts.. but 'some' could ;)
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| spd - 130.235.34.47 |
030304 @ 12:57:14 |
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both fuh and mqwcl allows you to change the gamma in glquake so no point using idGamma.
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030304 @ 13:28:25 |
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Nice to have some kind of support...
That idea seems nice, shouldnt be that much of a problem
Maybe the clans can state somehow on their status that they have a qwcl player so admins know from start.
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| ParadokS - 80.161.20.66 |
030304 @ 14:12:30 |
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The faker writing the big comment above, stating that admins could 'just' go and check qizmo users for those games. c'mon :)
It DOES take alot of time. And it's not time admins wanna waste, on that. And if there arent an admin present at that time, then what ? then u say u have to use mqwcl / fuhquake anywa... so just change and stop whine :)
That will be much easier for all.
We also force u to play on KTPRo. Its not like u have a choice.
We also force you to play with dmm1, and on certain maps.
We are not saying, ok lets all play with zquake and lets drop mqwcl/fuhquake.
There is no logic in that. To make it easier on players/clans/admins and scene in generel, its best from our pov to generalize the systems used. For example getting players to use a certain client, play on certain servers etc.
Its really not a big deal to change the client. If u and 5 others got a big problem, well what can i say. I'm sorry that the fact u need to change to a more up-todate client, outweighs the joy of actually playing quake.
That cannot be my problem, or the VAST majority of the other paticipants of NQR.
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| Vertigo - 157.24.114.122 |
030304 @ 14:16:43 |
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Cheating hasn't been a problem in QW for a long time. Banning the client, which everyone's been using since the starting of QW playing, just because there's a tiny chance of cheating, seems a bit harsh decision for me. Forcing people to play QW in a way they're not comfortable with, has always been a bad choise in our scene. QWCL-Qizmo will become extinct in near future, since FuhQuake and MQWCL are better clients, but there's still somewhat plenty of it's users around and closing them out of NQR wouldn't serve absolutely anyone's intrest. For those QWCL-Qizmo users I'd like to say that you guys really should find a way to fix FuhQuake working in your comp. It's a great client and you'll get dramatically better touch of playing/aiming/moving with it. I changed to FuhQuake from QWCL-Qizmo just weeks ago and I have to say I haven't had any regrets: I haven't played with QWCL-Qizmo since I first tested FuhQuake.
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| Goljat - 80.221.42.91 |
030304 @ 14:27:18 |
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horatio: come to #nqr and message me, i can help you, believe me its pretty easy to jump from qwcl/qizmo to mqwcl/qizmo. I guess you have sound or fps problem.
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| memil - 217.209.171.199 |
030304 @ 14:29:00 |
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sounds more and more lika tv shop commercials
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| ParadokS - 80.161.20.66 |
030304 @ 14:29:08 |
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Ok, re-reading my statement after post, I feel my point wasnt clear on certain areas.
We are trying to do what we believe is best for the community, and what will ease the work of present and future admins of both online leauges/tournaments and LAN events.
We believe that FuhQuake is going the right direction, and its deffinately open to input from gamers and 'officials'.
On the other hand mqwcl project is on icccceeeeeeeeee and qizmo developing is long gone.
Therefore its only natural that players try and keep just a little bit uptodate with whats happening. And if they can't accept those decisions made along the way, based on the arguments presented, then you have to make a choice.
Does this change some fundemental tings about the game, that you cannot accept ?
Are you not willing to comply, and make an effort, to make things run better in the long run ?
Do you not agree with their arguments ?
Does this decision really outweigh the joy u get from playing ?
Or... do you see some reason in it afterall, and with a little effort, this situation might not be so bad for you ?
Try and take into consideration, that quake is just quake. Without any competetions and the people behind, an active community with written and unwritten rules, we wouldn't be here. We wouldn't have an NQR, or a Smackdown. There would be no QHLAN finals.
To create a controlled enviroment, to make theese aspects of the QW community we know today florish and thrive, we have to set some boundries, wether you feel comfortable with them or not.
And don't think of NQR admins, or other voulenteers in the QW community as your enemy. They are actually trying to make things better from their beliefs, and they don't have the intention of laughing at you, cause now you can't use qizmo anymore.
So try enjoy Quake, and think about the fact, that alot of other people actually enjoy the same thing you do. And maybe think about why :)
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| blixem - 213.84.205.2 |
030304 @ 14:38:15 |
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gg to Link for battling his way to NQR admin, then REMOVING the maps HE doesnt like because he doesnt know them and gets owned there by clans that are not so good at dm3/dm2/e1m2 and decided to focus on a map that others dont know that well, so they have an advantage. something he does HIMSELF , like e1m5 with axemen.
Also killing some clans and what NQR was all about , with those rules (less clans could compete with the better clans because they could just focus on some exmx map)
And now somehow e1m5 is re-added when his clan enters again this is so fucking hilarious.
and then i wont even start on cmt
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| mrlame - 217.210.225.179 |
030304 @ 15:39:04 |
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actually almost the same case was with uf in the first nqr when uf had a "unknown" map which they won almost all clans on and then the admins got it voted out to kill the clan... but when link an admin wants an "unknown" map its ok?, so nice to see that ppl is turning their cape after the wind bg fett med bg
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| Tuna - 145.228.252.60 |
030304 @ 15:40:00 |
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wow.. and we havnt started yet at all... this is going to be a _lot_ of fun! :]
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| :EEE - 212.178.7.54 |
030304 @ 15:55:31 |
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Paradoks and Vert. I've changed to fuh some weeks ago too, keeping both mqwcl and qwcl+qizmo on my pc. First on Vert: the movement with Fuh is indeed great, then the aim TOTALLY SUCKS _FOR ME_. On the other case you state: indeed, cheating hasn't been problem in qw for a long time.
Para: what you are trying to do... you say it yourself:
"Does this change some fundemental tings about the game, that you cannot accept ? Are you not willing to comply, and make an effort, to make things run better in the long run ? Do you not agree with their arguments ? Does this decision really outweigh the joy u get from playing ? Or... do you see some reason in it afterall, and with a little effort, this situation might not be so bad for you ? Try and take into consideration, that quake is just quake. "
LOL?!?!? OMFG... about all I can say. Don't you think we want to keep the pleasure in the game? You think we are not willing to change clients. You think we do that to fuck up the rest of the quake community. You say we shouldn't compete in tournaments if we won't addept.
WHAT YOU DO IS FUCKING DISCRIMINATION. All of us have tried other clients, some longer, some shorter. AND YES we don't want to hold up 'the evolving in quake, decisions that are made on the road'. Omfg... now, read again what I stated and draw normal conclusions out of them.
You see us, the old users as mongols that are not willing to addept to another system and your forcing us to change with it. Still, we ARE willing to adept but in most situations quake is just less good. For me, mqwcl and fuh give me a way worse aim and that is no shit. That sure makes the game no fun at all.
GG seems like you don't want to make the game more fun for us at all. Please, be rational and show us you really have changed
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| kryten - 194.129.217.113 |
030304 @ 16:03:11 |
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there has to be a line drawn somewhere. when do we stop allowing more and more clients? with 5 clients? 10? 20? I know this is an exaggeration, but logic dictates that it is better to keep to as smaller number of clients as possible. Saying "there isnt cheating in QW" really doesn't have much strength - as league admins it is our responsibility to ENSURE that there is absolutely no cheating whatsoever. This decision was discussed a lot and the admin team all agreed it was for the best. Personally, I had my fair share of troubles changing clients but thanks to the FUH quake message boards I was able to find a solution for all of them.
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030304 @ 16:40:26 |
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well, finally my mqwcl works, it was a mouse issue. Still want to play qwcl though...
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030304 @ 17:27:53 |
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By the way, let every map be allowed, and give more points for winning:
2-0 = 5p, 2-1 = 3p and 1-2 = 1p
This should rule out the importance of "unknown" maps. And the better clan who knows the "accepted maps" gets alot more points than thoose who lives on their "unknown" map.
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| Goljat - 80.221.42.91 |
030304 @ 17:47:28 |
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5p lol i like more 1p per map system. I love this whine before,in and after season :)
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| Link - 80.203.229.225 |
030304 @ 18:10:25 |
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To blixem, admin-material mrlame, and all others who hate me and my god damn lame maps I choose, I say: I, because you blame me.
This is why we got the map pool we have, and why some map are not inn, so pay attention now, because even I get tired of repeating myself (I am sure you hate it too).
This is what I define as good map for 4on4 tdm:
- The map needs good design for 4on4, in other words...
- ...it should have the correct SIZE, not too big, not too small
- It should have a decent layout
- It should have few or no areas that are seldom or never used in the gameplay, or that don?t have a significant impact on the gameplay
- It should not have ?lame? areas (that?s a definition, but will be explained)
- It should not have areas that make a comeback almost impossible, because of how the map is designed.
These arguments can of course be questioned, because you can say that running around alone in some room at e4m6 got vital impact on the gameplay, when the 7 other players are having ?fun? in the RL-RA-PENTA-RING-WATER-ROOM, that is of course correct, but I still say that is really bad for 4on4, no matter how fun you think it is.
I LOVE e1m3!, it is one of my all time favorite maps, but hey, the crappy YA-entrance from water destroys the 4on4 aspect, its TOO EASY to camp there, so no matter how much I love it, I understand why it can?t be in the map-pool.
e4m3 is another good map, loved by many Swedes as well =) The map got multiple quads and rings, but many ppl think that is fun on this ?bunnyjumping? map. But what do you know, the map got only 4 spawns...gg maplock?
So when ppl accuse me for putting maps I WANT FOR MY PERSONAL benefit, then all I can say is: F...hmmm...I can?t say that, I am an admin :(
Maps like e3m4 and e2m5, are really BAD maps for 4on4. The maps are too big, they got really CRAPPY design and layout for 4on4 tdm. There are some totally useless areas on those maps. e3m4 even got 2 pentas...nice. e2m5 was built by a bridge constructor, even worse :(
Even maps like e2m2 and e3m1, that are inn the map pool, I don?t think is good for 4on4. e2m2 got some really useless water areas and e3m1 got some really useless slime areas. But hey, surprise mrlame, I am not the only one in the admin crew. Smackdown admins MADE you play e2m2, and some of you accepted it, and now it is an ?accepted? exmx map. Then you got maps like e1m5, a map that has excellent design for 4on4, and plays very well in a 4on4. Ok, so many of you don?t KNOW the tactics on it, but hey, plz compare the map design and layout to e3m4 and e2m5, and you DO GET THE POINT?
I thought e2m7 was a crap map some time ago, it was not because the map was too big, I thought just the design and layout was pure BS. Then I agreed to give it a chance, and HangTime showed it to me and learned it to me, the tactics...the works. Then I changed my opinion, because I now understood the map. And since the map had a good SIZE for 4on4, and items was well spread out, I saw that it worked for 4on4 tdm.
So no matter HOW MUCH I know and LOVE e1m3, e2m5, e3m4, e4m6 etc; the maps got some issues, no matter if its design, layout, size or whatever...THAT DON?T FIT FOR 4ON4 TDM GAMEPLAY.
So when you are gonna judge if a map is good or not, don?t go by the ?I know that? or ?I don?t know that? argument. Try to look at other things. If you don?t know the map, and don?t care about knowing it; sorry, not our problem, that?s YOUR problem.
You may of course disagree with all this, but hey, we are admins, you are not...sorry :/
If you want to make a point, come with good thoughtout and good arguments, not the usual crap...
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| Link - 80.203.229.225 |
030304 @ 18:18:27 |
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Oh, and e1m5/e3m7 was in nqr2 and nqr3, and now in nqr4. So if JAMS and GAMBLERS haden't played in nqr3, you would say e2m7 and e1m6 should not be in either? lol. e1m5 and e3m7 has not been re-added, they never left the map-pool. But hey, I agree, they where not up on the web. Well, thas is NOT MY FAULT :-)
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| El maco_13.5 - 213.64.246.243 |
030304 @ 18:59:08 |
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hej ! ja ?r en trevlig quaker+lunare+csare+saft o bulls p? 13 o ett halvt v?rar som s?ker en likasinnig o f?rloja oskulden till.. Det g?r bra med mission?ren...!? Ett litet snoppsug d??!.... AJIGHT pill i rumpan med inoljad tumme .. H. dreambojj ps. besvarar inte oseri?sa medd!
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030304 @ 19:02:48 |
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Well, i for one don?t think that Link is an idiot. Really guys it is not the maps u hate it is Link himeslf. It is so obvious...
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| er - 159.134.224.97 |
030304 @ 19:52:36 |
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Idgamma is better, probably due to my gfx card, mainly due to the fact that when i higher gamma in it without idgamma the lava blinds me, and others use it to. fs, such a big problem for it?
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| and - 159.134.224.97 |
030304 @ 19:55:06 |
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I've tried fuhquake and mqwcl BOTH with out it and same affect, lava's too bright and blinds me. I use both clients, not qwcl and qizmo.
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030304 @ 20:38:42 |
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Goliat, i don?t think 1p per map is such a good idea, then u get all whine about the unknown maps is of too great importance to the leaguesystem. I think u shold get more points for winning 2-0 and 2-1 than just 3 and 2 points. A clan whith an unknown map can loose 2-1 all the time and get quite a lot of points...
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| xhrl - 142.22.16.51 |
030304 @ 21:14:56 |
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the idea that fuhquake can't be tweaked legitimately to get the feel/aim of qwcl or mqwcl is false. fuhquake is extremely customizable, just learn how to do it. It takes a bit of time to get fuhquake the way y0u like it; but it can be done. shit, if I can do it, anyone can :)
xhrl
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| razor - 213.66.159.8 |
030304 @ 22:01:09 |
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yes it should be more points for 2-0 and 2-1... i think what u dislike goljat is that 2-0 gives more points then 2-1.. .. well i think that is good thou.. 2-0 should be awarded somehow :) but plz not 1p/map.. then at least have like 3p for both 2-0 and 2-1 and then 1p for 1-2... but what i would like is 2-0 = 4p.... 2-1= 3p...... 1-2 = 1p
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030304 @ 22:15:03 |
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3p for both 2-0 and 2-1
That sounds stupid, but otherwise good thoughts...
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030304 @ 23:08:26 |
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Btw, add some fixtures so we can start rape div4, i am eagerbeaver
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| HangTime - 213.208.111.197 |
030304 @ 23:32:20 |
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about e1m5... personally I think it looks reasonably suited for play as a 4on4 map, I quite like it. However the problem I think most people have is that it seems to have been suddenly added to the list purely for the benefit of one clan, and one clan alone. Just look at nqr3 stats, e1m5 was NEVER played, not even once. So it seems to me 90% of clans dont want e1m5 included, and adding it to the list is purely a tactical move to give Link's clan an advantage. Please, please can we just rename it to axemen.bsp?
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| Link - 217.70.229.196 |
030305 @ 00:23:12 |
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lol HT. Of course it is only one clan that plays e1m5, ye thats us. BTW: there is only ONE clan who plays e2m7 too, so answer me this: is it fair that JAMS gets their map, but other clans dont? This means that if JAMS did not play nqr3, then e2m7 also would have been played 0 times, and if Gamblers had not played, e1m6 would be played 0 times too (yes, KOFF was dead in nqr3). YOU DO UNDERSTAND that the exmx maps are usually only played by 1 or maybe 2 clans? So should we then be unfair to some clans then? It has nothing to do with ME or MY clan, it has to do with letting the clans play their belowed homemap...AS LONG AS IT FITS FOR 4ON4 (as described in my big post above). And you also understand that the map looks ok for 4on4, so why was it wrong to keep it? (dont use the 0 played in nqr3 argument, would you use that IF axemen had played in nqr3?) It is NOT MY FAULT that certain individuals took those maps away without having an admin meeting about it, but did it on their own without making sure the whole group agreed on it. Does it matter anyway? Would the clans go prac e1m5/e3m7 like hell if it was not taken away? I dont think so. Ppl, stop whining and blaming me for using my admin position for my own benefit...if my I only cared about my ego, then there would certaintly be some maps that would not be inn, but according to some OTHER admins, they will get played, and ye, the maps are "ok" for 4on4, so ok then, lets please those clans. Poor poor div. 1 clans who has to play e1m5 for 20 mins in nqr4, I FEEL SO SORRY FOR YOU! Btw: Slackers beat us at e1m5 here the other day in a prac game. We dont choose the map coz we MUST win, we choose it because we think it is a VERY good map for 4on4. Any more whiners out there?
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| TiMMi - 80.202.131.126 |
030305 @ 00:29:27 |
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Thank you for wanting to rename a map after our glorious clan. I think its TIME to HANG yourself. :p
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| Vertigo - 157.24.114.122 |
030305 @ 00:52:55 |
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"YOU DO UNDERSTAND that the exmx maps are usually only played by 1 or maybe 2 clans? So should we then be unfair to some clans then?" DO YOU UNDERSTAND that the QIZMO-QWCL system is still used by plenty of QW players - not 1 or 2, but more! So should you be unfair to these players and disallow QWCL-Qizmo? Geesh Link, you really don't have a point there. You're losing your grip.
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| Babel - 217.209.185.105 |
030305 @ 00:55:35 |
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I would love to se 4on4 on e1m5, so please play it this season. Link, can you send me some new e1m5 4on4 demo? =). Im not ironic, I just remember how fun that map was to play RQ FFA 250lms in the old days.
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| kryten - 195.112.2.149 |
030305 @ 01:00:52 |
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Touch? vertigo :]
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| Link - 217.70.229.196 |
030305 @ 01:01:18 |
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I can send u MVD axe vs cmf + some other e1m5 games from nqr2, this weekend when I get home, just MSG me.
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| Link - 217.70.229.196 |
030305 @ 01:13:33 |
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Vert, I am not INVOLVED in the client issue, I don't know anything about it, thats other admins job, I got other deeds, as you surely know. Amazing how much shit ppl can digg up when it comes to whining. You like e1m5 vert, admit it :)
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| Link - 217.70.229.196 |
030305 @ 01:17:03 |
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Oh, I forgot, the client issue is about possible cheating is it not? (at least I think I know that much...after reading all these comments), so what's that got to do with maps? Absolutely nothing. lol vert. And if you wanna throw more whine about clients, rant at some other admins not me =) If you wanna rant at me, stick to map, not clients, thank you =)
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| ApoKaLypZe - 213.116.251.28 |
030305 @ 01:24:33 |
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Yeah, cmt5 rocks...exactly the correct size "var finns penta? :)" (c) Eta-Beta.
Whatever..."Both sides" has written both smart arguments but also a lot of crap.
Yeah, I think that this "qwcl+qizmo-ban" is discrimination too, since it has worked fine for so many years now.
I think that e1m5 is way better than some other exmx-maps that has been approved in nqr-league season 4.
I think that legioneer and kryten does a good and neutral job as admins, enough said.
But then again I also think that it?s good that SOMEONE else volonteers (spelling?) as extra-admins for the online-leagues, or else online-qw would probably be quite dead by now.
But then again, this is just my oppinion about it, so let?s all just stfu and start the season with the current rules, and take the rest in consideration to next season =B-)
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| Link - 217.70.229.196 |
030305 @ 01:36:18 |
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CMT is about feedback, and thats what we are getting, so thanks for the feedback :P
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| Legio! - 217.210.255.154 |
030305 @ 01:59:17 |
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Couldn't have said it better my self Apokalypze. Yes ppl plz go and play your games and enjoy your selves..its Fragging Time!! =]
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| Horatio - 217.209.217.207 |
030305 @ 09:01:23 |
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e1m6 rokks, we won 11 out of 12 games there last season =).
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| :EEE - 212.178.7.55 |
030305 @ 10:17:07 |
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and still no progress in the qwcl qizmo case... Keep the good work up guys! And indeed, I couldn't have said it better myself ApoKaLypZe:
"Yeah, I think that this "qwcl+qizmo-ban" is discrimination too, since it has worked fine for so many years now."
and so what you say Legio!
"Yes ppl plz go and play your games and enjoy your selves..its Fragging Time!! =]"
Oh yea, what we will have a lot of fun!! Especially with a nice row with the admins!! Who haven't showed a single intention to let qwcl+qizmo allowed!!
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| Goljat - 195.10.181.164 |
030305 @ 10:49:47 |
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"Yeah, I think that this "qwcl+qizmo-ban" is discrimination too, since it has worked fine for so many years now"
Yeah no shit then there was only one qw client and now there are like three. It's really hard to see do you have original qizmo if there is only one or teammate with qizmo. That needs 2lines text to qw source and you have fake qizmo reports. Don't say that bullshit "i'm not cheating check my demos". You can't see lasershaft or fullbright backpaks etc.. in demo.
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| Legio! - 213.141.72.130 |
030305 @ 11:03:39 |
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:EEE The qwcl-qizmo is of the past the decision has been made.
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| kryten - |
030305 @ 12:50:00 |
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"Oh yea, what we will have a lot of fun!! Especially with a nice row with the admins!! Who havent showed a single intention to let qwcl+qizmo allowed!!" -- indeed we havent showed that intention, because we arent gonna let it be allowed. the discussions we have made here have been to explain the reasons behind the decision, not to give people a chance to change our minds. as legio said, the decision has been made and it wasnt made lightly. the league has started now, lets focus on the qw. if anyone has any problems in converting from qwcl to fuh then i am more than willing to help - just msg me in #nqr.
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| Jjonez - 217.136.239.189 |
030306 @ 01:23:31 |
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oh look!
a pointless discussion about clients again. thats been a while :)
if you dont like the rules, dont play in the league. it's really not that hard to understand.
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| blixem - 213.84.205.2 |
030306 @ 14:27:12 |
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i have read only link's first comment after mrlame and mine ..
Link you are so stupipd , what makes you think YOU are the one to decide if a map is suited for tp or not ? you fucking suck at qw ? apparently a lot of people DISAGREE with you ? but you think you are god and what you say is law or something ... so sad...
" ... i can send you e1m5 mvd of axe vs cmf.."
look at you being so proud of a victory on good clans on such maps , thats fun right ? winning on such a map when you have no chance at all on all other maps ? you took that away from some other clans , that were just like you , do you realise that ?
and apparently , its not LUCKmaps or such , because why did clans like UF then win that map almost always ?
i can send you fs vs uf demo which shows its a fun tp map too btw.. and also fs vs axe e1m5 *RAPE*
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| blixem - 213.84.205.2 |
030306 @ 14:30:32 |
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" .. Btw: Slackers beat us at e1m5 here the other day in a prac game. We dont choose the map coz we MUST win, we choose it because we think it is a VERY good map for 4on4. Any more whiners out there? .. "
lol you sound as if you scored a point there and and made a good point ... with that "any more whiners"
dont you see you cant defend yourselve in any reasonable way ?
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| TiMMi - 80.202.131.126 |
030306 @ 14:55:46 |
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"look at you being so proud of a victory on good clans on such maps , thats fun right ?"
If you would have done some research, you would have known that we actually lost both our matches versus cmf in nqr#2.
Stop this foolish personal argue. e3m7 and e1m5 is in this season, as in any other nqr season. Please come with some arguments about why you dont want them Instead of wasting your breath flaming link.
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| mrlame - 217.210.225.179 |
030306 @ 15:02:38 |
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played 0 times in nqr3, does it need anymore arguments?, and no axeman was not in nqr3 but shall nqr let everyone single clan decide what map they want?, then why remove e4m3 like uf had?
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| TiMMi - 80.202.131.126 |
030306 @ 15:15:32 |
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Please dont ignore things that have been talked about earlier. It was not my decision to take away those cool maps. But you cant stand up and say that uf's map is a better map than the one we are left with? If you do so. I really dont understand what kind of vision you have of a good 4on4 map. I would actually ask why you play dm3, dm2, e1m2 at all.
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| TiMMi - 80.202.131.126 |
030306 @ 15:16:47 |
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And your 0 times argument.. I know its some out there that has nothing against e1m5 and e3m7, but its just not their favourite. And hey; Thats perfectly okay.
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| Goljat - 80.221.42.91 |
030306 @ 15:32:53 |
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axemen: better idea to stop whining here and answer to my question at #axemen. Tried two fucking days to get game between you and still no answer.
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| Humblegar - 217.70.229.196 |
030306 @ 23:22:53 |
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Admins/webmasters:
In stead of just mentioning new maps (or other rules) in the "news" section, please update in- and refer to the "rules" section. Right now you have 2 different set of maps listed on the site.
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| Link - 217.70.229.39 |
030307 @ 16:34:31 |
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Why answer all this when it has already been answered in earlier comments? mrlame makes questions and arguments that has already been answered, and still he asks them...look at this; "then why remove e4m3 like uf had?" lol. But why expect ppl to read all comments, most dont even read all the rules. I guess I am pretty stupid to read all comments then, and Blix is really intelligent because he does not. If you want a league with e4m8, e3m4, e2m5, e4m6 etc. , then go and make some CTF league, the maps should be more suited for that; higher speed + grappling hook.
And what does my qw skill (or lack of it) have to do with anything of this? Another great argument?
And Blix, lol, we lost to FS, CMF, DALTONS + some more clans on e1m5, so digg up something else plz. The reason we loose to better clans on e1m5 is that it is a good 4on4tdm map, can you say the same on the NQR2 UF games on e3m4?
And when it comes to maps, it is actually really EASY to pick out what is a good 4on4 map, but hell yeah, lets have mrlame pick them out, he thinks dm3 sucks bigtime, and that e3m4 is good. I guess it comes down to what kind of 4on4 game you want. And for the record; I dont think no one of you are "fucking stupid", but if you like to call me that; you are welcome to!
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| mrlame - 217.210.225.179 |
030307 @ 19:05:10 |
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its BIG difference in what is fun playing and bad map link as e1m5 is both boring and bad map, dm3 is atleast good map but boring to play cuz of the cs style and e4m3 is not a good map but hell yeah its fun and thats the mort important
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| Link - 217.70.229.39 |
030307 @ 19:15:34 |
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well, when you rate e3m4 as a better (fun or whatever you like to call it) 4on4 map than e1m5...what can I say?
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| TiMMi - 80.202.131.126 |
030307 @ 19:22:03 |
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So, if you would be the man in charge, you would just pick maps after what YOU find funny to play on? That would be a little selfish, wouldnt it? Good 4on4 maps are the maps that most people like to play, so thats why they are prefered before e4m3..
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vs. HellFire 
vs. Paranoids 
vs. Dybbuk 